01/12/2017 at 2:36 pm #2849
So here we are in a dedicated space to show and share how we treat male flowers before/during pollination.
I will make time to give a detailed report on how I collect my male pollen and add this over the next few weeks as I have just started turning a few girls with my STS solution.
The following image illustrates what I am aiming for.
Attachments:01/12/2017 at 2:50 pm #2851
After the first treatment of my special STS mixture it takes approximately 4-5 weeks before viable pollen is released when flowering an average 8-10 week hybrid strain.
When the “males” mature I remove the first male flowers that stat opening by hand and repeat for 24-48 hrs. as I do not use the first pollen, I believe it was R.C.Clarke that mentioned not to use the first pollen in his book “Marijuana Botany”, how many I remove exactly depends as I grow mostly intuitively.
My “male” plants usually look like the following images around week 4-5 f flowering.
Attachments:01/12/2017 at 3:08 pm #2854
In the first image of previous post you can see a large amount of male flowers have opened up and started to release pollen, this is the point I start extracting.
While extracting a few times every day for 3-4 days I place the males in the same tent/room with the females so wind pollination can start, but as soon as I start pollinating I know I have to finish in three days as more days will potentially cause more immature seeds when harvest starts.
Now this is “milking” of the males not necessary as pollination by wind and some manual shaking of the males over the females will do the trick most of the time, but by combining the two I get a higher amount of seeds as I can make sure all the pistils are pollinated…even the lowest ones.01/12/2017 at 3:10 pm #2855
Really appreciate you putting this information on here, as someone who has not had a lot of time in the past to be able to breed I have had the time to grab bits of information from the internet. I’ve yet to buy R.C. Clarke’s book as well as the “Teaming with” series by Jeff Lowenfels regarding organics.
There’s a lot of information out there and everyone has their own way of doing things that works for them so it’s going to be great getting more insight in to your methods as it’s another tool in my box.
I’m still not 100% sure on my competance with STS and when it comes to making seed for my own use I will probably with start with the basics of selecting a good male plant.
Before I get to that stage though I need to stockpile my herb collection a bit more and growing out the Seedclub collections will be great as I’ll have a quick turnaround from feminised genetics.01/12/2017 at 3:18 pm #2856
Tools I use:
I use these to pull off male flowers
2. Small containers
To store pollen and flowers after collecting in white tray
3. White tray
To hold under the branches/flowers while using tweezers
4. Wide fan Brush
To carefully brush pollen from white tray into smaller container01/12/2017 at 3:22 pm #2857
btw, I provide my STS mixture already to a few breeders through my UK distributor for a few years now and they are very satisfied, I am in process of starting to offer it through my web shop soon in small enough amounts to turn 1-2 plants.01/12/2017 at 3:27 pm #2858
In this video I made you can see that I keep my pollen/flowers in a small container, once I know the pollen is dry I can close the lid and use it to pollinate as shown in the video.01/12/2017 at 3:50 pm #2861
btw, I provide my STS mixture already to a few breeders through my UK distributor for a few years now and they are very satisfied, I am in process of starting to offer it through my web shop soon in small enough amounts to turn 1-2 plants.
This is a brilliant bit of news, especially for myself as I have been confused about the mixing process and as I said before I wouldn’t trust my competency with something like that so a mixed solution provided by an artisan such as yourself would remove a MASSIVE margin of error.
Having the option to create more seed that wouldn’t need sexing that is stable is a huge benefit for myself personally, as I don’t mind the time growing from seed and prefer the true structure of a seed plant rather than a cutting. I have cuttings and I have ran cuttings in the past and never seem to get the thickness and support from the stem “framework” that you get from a seed plant.
A question I would like to ask is, How much limitation to the Gene pool and Phenotype expression is there from the use of STS produced pollen compared with Natural male pollen?02/12/2017 at 10:17 am #2863
To be honest I have no answer to the loss of pheno´s through STS.
As long as the traits I am breeding for come through in the seeds I am satisfied, but a next generation would only be able to inherit some of those traits left as an (unknown) amount of pheno´s from the “male” donor are potentially lost.
I am one of the lucky ones with a stable, tested library of strains that consists mostly of regular genetics, and since I only really breed 1 generation away from these regular genetics I have all the phenotypes still stored in my plants.
Where many companies breed through buying a few packs of fem seeds and select from them, this is where there is a limited pool of phenotypes due to the lack of some of the males traits.
But this is where actual research should be done to find exactly what happens through generations.02/12/2017 at 10:20 am #2864
It is a little different when creating an S1, selfing already lacks the input of a male so I guess all the traits of the females used should be available in the S1 generation.02/12/2017 at 1:37 pm #2865
Cool, great info which leads to my next question… If you kept using STS on one Phenotype would it still produce seed with all available Phenotypes to the S1 one created or would it start to lock it down to that single Phenotype?02/12/2017 at 10:20 pm #2866
Now I have to be honest here, I am not very good at the science,
As far as I know with a S1 generation we can open up the phenotypes and this generation can have a variety of all phenotypes of the parents used from which a next selection is used to continue isolating a certain trait, but that is how this works with regular genetics and I am not sure about selfed STS strains.
But selfing, selecting and selfing again etc. is not the way to breed for traits as multiple generations treated with STS will probably result in lack of hybrid vigor etc.
But not 100% sure how it works, would be nice to get R.C.Clarke to come round and teach us a bit…lol03/12/2017 at 10:28 am #2867
I guess it’s a case of using the regular genetics to “true breed” the strain for the phenotype you’re looking for and then using STS on the end result to guarantee a female seed plant.
True breeding and stabilizing is something I have done some reading about, I’m really dumb when it comes to understanding Mendelian Law and mapping the genetic traits though!
If I was breeding to sell seed this is something I would definitely drive my business on but as a personal grower I think I would most definitely just like to “back up” something that I’ve found that I really like and don’t wish to go through the whole sexing process again as initially it takes a while and also I don’t have the space to counter the male:female ratio’s.
You must be logged in to reply to this topic.